Dogmatic Statement from an Emerging Fundamentalist September 8, 2007
Posted by brotherjohnny in God, confession, emergent, fundamentalist, heart.trackback
Over the last week or so, I’ve had probably five or six things that I’ve wanted to write about here.
Too bad I can’t remember any of them at the moment.
Instead, I’m going to write about something that is really weighing on my heart today.
But how am I going to present this?
I think I’ll try right off the top off my head and straight from the hip.
It’s a sad, sad day when those in the believing community (rather it be local or at large), consider the broken body and shed blood of Jesus Christ to be insufficient or even irrelevant to their spiritual (which is their only) lives.
This matter touches on everything from the forgiveness of sins (which some deem to be such a small, small, matter), to the entrance into and residence within the Kingdom of God (which, all of a sudden, seems to be such a huge, gigantic matter).
These two matters cannot truly be separated.
It would seem as if there is some sort of mass movement which is based upon works rather than faith, whose aim is….honestly, I don’t know what their aim is.
I suppose that it is ‘world peace” or something akin to it.
Surely it’s just a reaction to the ‘all about me’ mentality which has saturated the Christian world for so long now.
I also understand that there is a reaction coming from the ‘evangelical fundamentalists’ against the ‘emergent church’, and that one of the points of contention is this very issue of the value and purpose of the sacrificial elements of Christ on the cross.
Personally, I don’t think the ‘emergers’ actually have a unified statement of faith on this matter. I think that, at least to some degree, a ’statement of faith’ is something that the ‘emergers’ are not all that interested in.
Not yet, anyway 
.
I’m no expert on what the ‘emergent church’ is, but as far as I can tell, the only consistency that I see in them is the fact that they are a conversation that seems to really emphasize the teachings of Jesus.
I think that if I were to take a shot at what I thought their statement of faith was, it would center on ‘the sermon on the mount’.
I could, I suppose, systematically write out everything that I believe to be true about my relationship to and with God, and then call that a statement of faith.
That would take way too long.
Just read my blog. 
There are lot’s of faith statement here.
Emergers are interested in conversation and re-thinking…, or as one brother like to say ‘re-imagining’, the Christian faith.
Personally, I think that is a healthy thing.
There must be room for free thinking and not just accepting what the so called ‘authorities’ have to say.
More importantly, there must neccesarily be freedom for the the Spirit of God to lead us into all truth while not neccesarily hanging on to every word that comes from the mouths of ‘Christianity Today’, TBN, Brian Mclaren, Dave Hunt, DayStar, SeedSowers, Thomas Nelson, Zondervan, “Brother Johnny”, Pasture Scott, Mike Morrell, the SBC, the Vatican, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc,…….
(Get the point!? )
It’s not that these brothers and sisters don’t have truth.
It’s that we also have truth in us, if were truly born of the Spirit of God.
(I’m sure some of our ‘emerging’ brothers and sisters might have a new perspective on what that means ….so…shoot if you’d like)
Some of them like to use new terms in place of older ones, like ‘framing story’ instead of ‘context’.
Hey, fine by me.
No complaints here.
Old words sometimes carry old baggage, so using new words can restore authentic or original meaning, while setting us free from distracting mental associations.
But let’s get to the point.
Original meaning.
Authenticity.
What are the ‘unchangeables’?
What are the ‘unalterables’?
Maybe these do vary from person to person.
I’ll tell you what mine are.
These are the ones that ‘make or break’ brotherhood in my book. If I am to find myself within your flock, you will certainly possess these particular feathers.
Mankind, outside of the provision made by God in Jesus Christ, is rotten to the core.
He is more than just ‘tarnished’.
He is altogether defective and beyond repair.
It takes a Miracle to make him right and true, and this miracle is the reception of the Gift of the Almighty, the ‘amen’ to the offering of the Lamb of God, the Atonement which is only in Christ, which was demonstrated at the cross of Calvary.
If you amen this, and truly mean it, then I believe that I have no problem at all calling you my Brother.
I dunno.
Maybe after reading this, you may not want to be called my brother.
You might be pipin’ hot right about now.
You know what?
I think I love you….
Yeah…
I’m pretty sure….
Yep…there is something going on inside of me that is loving you, for certain.
But you can’t do it.
You can’t be right in and of yourself.
You can talk about it, and you can pretend, that’s about it.
Oh, sure, you can do good things. You can keep rules.
You can even do ‘christian things’, but you know what? God doesn’t count those things.
Pretty bold statement, huh? Want to kill me yet?
I understand.
But you can’t please God.
Jesus Christ pleases God.
Only what Jesus Christ does pleases God.
Oh my! How narrow minded of me!!
Are you mad yet? Seriously, I’m not trying to antagonize you here, I am only speaking the truth. Someone has to turn on the Light.
Even Jesus said, “Only God is good.”
I am not a good man. You are not a good person.
So where’s your hope?
In Christ.
Are you there?
I am.
I can boast in my Lord.
What do you boast in? Think you are smart or special? Do you really think that your personality or your style can make you spotless before the Almighty?
You are nothing apart from God.
But He has made full pardon for your sins and sinfulness.
In Jesus Christ.
He was humiliated, tortured, beaten, bruised, ridiculed, and killed in your stead.
He went through hell so that you don’t have to.
Now that is a friend.
Do you have any idea how horrible of a person you are?
Even if you are not overtly ’sinful’ your superficial piety is disgusting to the One who knows all.
He sees through you.
But praise God, that Jesus Christ has made a way for you.
He became that superficial piety and that overt sinfulness, and He was then killed, taking those things to the grave.
But then, HE was raised from the dead and now He is at the right hand of the Father, and He represents His people.
He died for the sins of all, and you are a part of that all.
He has pardoned you via his broken body and shed blood.
And this is not just for you, it is for all who might recieve it.
It’s given freely….
just take it, freely.
Seriously.
Take it freely.
It’s a trade off.
All your sins, for the Love and favor of God.
Sounds too good to be true, I know…, but it’s true.
God is that good.
Maybe you have done this already. Maybe it was long ago but have since decided that you no longer need this foundation.
Hmmm.
Ever tried to pull a foundation out from under a house? What would happen to that house?
Maybe you need your foundation checked for cracks instead…
God’s goodness is always and will always be One with the person and work of Jesus Christ.
So.
Now am I a ‘fundamentalist’?
I don’t think so, but I think I understand the importance of having the fundamental things in their proper place.
So am I ‘emergent’?
Again, I don’t think so, but I understand the necessitiy of emerging beyond the neccesary and elemental aspects of our faith.
Call me what you want.
Love me or hate me, this is who I am.
Peace (or a sword?)
Brother,
Thanks for your post.
Could it be that we want to label anything that comes along that is new? Frankly, lets just stick with Jesus and His teachings, that should keep us busy until He comes back, right?
His blessings upon you,
Richard
Honestly, I’m not so sure that there really is anything new (under the sun) other than God’s mercies (which are new EVERY morning)!!
The Lord Jesus told His disciples that His words were (are) Spirit and Life.
I certainly do hold to His words, but I also hold to Him.
Although I’m sure that you are not saying that the rest of scripture isn’t important, I would like to clarify that it’s my belief that we should value it all the same.
)
Paul, John, James, etc…
(okay, okay…the old testament too…
It was God who spoke through Jesus, but it was also God who spoke through the other writers of scripture as well.
(I know you know all of this, but I’m just elaborating).
Even still, there is a good amount of scripture which points to the necessity of the Lords people learning to live by the Spirit rather than the letter, as one works death, while the other brings life.
My understanding of Jesus’ teachings is that they lead us to to an experience in and of Him rather than them being the ‘Divine Handbook to Christian Living’.
Amen, this is true.
There is just so much “junk food” out there in Christendom. We best stay with Christ, and not the latest fad or teaching that comes along.
Be blessed,
Richard
[...] begins my dear friend and former Atlanta community-mate Johnny in a post entitled Dogmatic Statement from an Emerging Fundamentalist. I don’t think Johnny is truly emerging into fundamentalism, but his frustration (and good, [...]
I posted these replies to Mike Morrell’s article on this quest of Johnny’s, and am just copying them here:
Peter K Bell
Sep 12th, 2007 at 2:54 pm
I’m just like Brian Smith, Johnny, and Mike in this: I don’t have acres and oceans of time in front of me, the quantity and quality of time and attention needed to even begin to face this issue with the degree of importance–with the CENTRALITY of focus–that it rightly deserves (and actually HAS) in our spiritual (which is our ONLY) lives, to quote Johnny…
So I will give this a ‘lick and a promise’ (as the old saying goes) and say only the following about it as my knee-jerk ‘instant’ response:
1) I am making a promise to go ‘inward’ and look into the witness of my Spirit on this topic, to see what I may have to add to the conversation, as soon as a little of that coveted time becomes available.
2) Historic revivalism (from AT LEAST the Moravians and the Pietists in Europe to the great American camp-meeting awakenings of the past 2 centuries–not to skip Wales, Azusa Street, and many others) often contains the testimony that a re-discovery (which in the case of most individuals is a NEW discovery)of the life-giving properties of the cross, the blood of Jesus, the atonement, has the power to transform individual lives and consequently the state of society. The reason I mention this it to confirm the validity and key importance of Johnny’s current quest.
3) The fullest, richest, craziest, most intensely personal, most radical and most complete single source of understanding of this topic, spiritually, theologically, poetically, and experientially all rolled into one–that I have ever run across in my own search–is the Revelations of Divine Love by Julian of Norwich. The love of God for us is the only ground of all God has done for us in Jesus, and Madame Julian spells this out incredibly thoroughly. Please forgive me for exalting any human vessel this much, but I am quickened and rejuvenated in my spirit nearly every time I read Julian, and this refreshing comes directly from her treatment of the atonement and its application to our individual experience.
4) Oh yeah, there is one other part of my “knee-jerk” response I want to toss in here:
In our growing home group of ‘Recovering Baptists’ we had a rather intense discussion a couple of Fridays ago about whether (why, how, how much, etc.) we need to repent and receive forgiveness after our initial justification or ‘born-again’ experience. I responded passionately, in three ways:
>1) Immediately I prophecied over the most worried and self-condemning of the saints there, by the Word of the Lord: “I see no sin in you.”
>2) As soon as I got home I fired off to the whole group a link to John Wesley’s sermon of 240 years ago called “Repentance of Believers.”
>3) The next morning I woke up with a complete sermon outline (only we don’t do sermons in our group!!) on the topic. The essence of this says that in our ordinary lives we have far too weak a view of how bad the bad (the “old life”) in us really is, and far too weak a view of just how wonderful and powerful and miraculous the nature of the new life of Christ in us actually is too. I have not been able to share this fully with the group yet, but I carry it as a (light and easy) burden for the church, that we would see this and come to know the reality of it, for the sake of the victory and power it will release into our lives.
I have a feeling that all this is intimately tied in with Johnny’s quest–in ways that I haven’t even discovered yet!! I look forward to looking farther into this.
5) One final comment:
“The only thing in the Scripture”? Well, yes, actually, I see that this IS the only thing in the Scripture, in this sense:
In “The Man Born to Be King,” Dorothy Sayers has Mary the mother of Jesus say of the crucifixion of Jesus, “This is the only thing that has ever happened.”
I agree: this is the center of reality, the Lamb on the throne, slain before the foundation of the world. This is where all the rest of it comes from, and where it is all heading as well.
I agree with Johnny that this is a “key.”
In the interest of furthering the conversation,
Peter
{Note: This is an edited version of a comment I tried to post over at Mike’s blog. I tried to post it twice over there, so there must be some kind of technical difficulty}
It is the oneness that Jesus shares with His Father which keeps me from viewing His (crucifixion) as a “Dad conceived me to kill me” frame of mind.
In fact, God became everything (and everyone) that ever could have been against God and took it all to the grave.
AND THEN HE ROSE AGAIN.
There was death for Jesus, but it could not hold Him.
Same for us who are born of Him.
Jesus, while facing His death said to His misunderstanding (however sincere and well meaning) followers, “Don’t weep for me. Weep for yourselves because you don’t believe.”
“Death” is such a tragic thing to those who cannot see beyond it.
Don’t get me wrong.
I mourn the loss of my loved ones (and even strangers sometimes!!), but all in all, it’s because I miss them, not because I see death as the ‘grand finale’.
One of the most blessed things about being in Christ is the fact that, although Christ died, we do not have to ‘miss’ Him.
He Is….here!!!!
We possess Him, and He is in our midst.
Okay…the last thing that I want to say for now is about the “Now what?” factor which Mike brought up earlier*.
First, check out the immediate scriptural context for John 3:16 verses 12-15 (NKJV):
“If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?
No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven.
And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up,that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life.”
There it is folks.
The Son of Man MUST be lifted up just as Moses lifted up the bronze serpent on his staff.
Now, 3:16:
“For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved”.
PURE SACRIFICIAL LOVE FOR THE WORLD.
And how is this salvation appropriated (or refused)?
“He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.”
Jesus declares that condemnation is a given! (YIKES!)
But then He also elaborates on what that condemnation is:
“And this is the condemnation, that the light (Christ) has come into the world, and men loved darkness (not Christ) rather than light, because their deeds were evil” (Because if Christ hadn’t come, mankind would not have known sin).
Now for the “Now what?” question:
“For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God.”
Deeds.
“Works” even.
The stuff we do (or don’t do).
Maybe even more accurately, ‘The Way we Live our (His) Life’.
But it is all founded in Christ…not only His teachings, which reveal the sinfulness of mankind, but also His work, which is the answer to that darkness.
The problem with considering truth to be theory, is that it prevents one from coming to the truth.
No offense, (from me) anyone.
I just callz ‘em like I seez ‘em.
Tick tock, tick tock, tick tock,…
Time…
More precious than gold.
Gotta run!
Grace to you all!
* The “Now what?” factor, I believe is more or less, “Now that we know that we have been redeemed by God, what do we do in light of that fact?”
salvation from there”.
My response at this point is, ” Let’s be sure that we are in the light of that fact, and then we can ‘work out’ our (notice the plural ‘our’ as opposed to the singular ‘my’
Hey thanks, Peter.
The life is in the blood.
Praise God!
I have a couple good posts cookin’ to follow up with, but I need to go for now.
Peace and grace to all.